In today’s episode we talk about the cycles of transformation. We also discuss getting back into your own natural rhythm, and finding the balance between seeking, integration and rest.

We also dive deep into resistance and how being out of touch with your own rhythm and body can show up, as it has in my own life. I get some great advice on how to move through it with love and grace.

We cover a lot and there’s some real gems in here, so grab a pen and paper and we hope you enjoy.

Dani: Hi, ladies. How are we doing this morning?

Natalie: Very good, thank you. And you?

Dani: We chatted a bit before about what we were going to talk about today, so I found this card very interesting. The card is called time to go. If we read the meaning, it says-

Candace: Which we may have read once before.

Natalie: It is a special card. The sun sets and rises each day, and it’s the same with the avenues in your life. See the beauty within each sunset in your life, and know that the sun will also rise again tomorrow. Endings are merely the start of a new beginning, and they are with you through each phase and cycle.

We decided that today we were going to talk about the phases of business, and the seasons of time, the things that we’re working on, and how it can be a tendency nowadays to go, go, go, and not see the cyclical nature of the journey.

I thought that card was just hilarious that’s what came out today, when we’d already decided our topic, because it’s perfect.

Candace: That is perfect. That is perfect.

Dani: Yeah. One thing you should know about Natalie is, she always pulls the perfect card. Always, without exception, if there is one card in the deck, Natalie’s spirit, Natalie’s energy, Natalie’s talent, Natalie’s connection will pull the right card every single time.

It never ceases to amaze. I don’t know why. We should just expect it from now on, but every time we get one, we’re like, “Oh my God. I can’t believe that card came up. It’s so perfect.”

Natalie:  I know. I did the same when it came out. I was like, “Oh, my goodness,” then, “Oh, of course.”

Dani: I love that so much. Yeah, we thought we would talk about just change cycles, and how there is a season for everything. I thought maybe for an intro, I would just share the one that we learned in life coaching training, is there’s this chart with basically four sections, and you start with death and rebirth.

These are big life changes, these are big revelations, these are big things that happen. There’s a grieving period, and a time for self care, time for reflection, time for these kinds of things. Then it’s dreaming and scheming.

Stage two is dreaming and scheming. You know you’re coming out of stage one of that grief, and that loss, and that letting go, and everything when you start wanting to make changes, and you start getting creative ideas, and you start these things. You start dreaming and scheming about what you really want, and how you’re gonna get there, and you start playing with those things.

Then the third part is the hero’s saga. We’re all familiar with this kind of thing, whether it’s in the archetypes, or the mythology, or anything, the hero’s saga. The hero sets out on a journey, and there are all these obstacles and things that come out, that the hero has to go through to get to stage four, which is promised land.

Promised land is like, “Ahhh!” Everything is in alignment, glorious. A couple of things … number one, with stage four, you always know a new stage one is coming, because that is the cycle. It doesn’t ever end.

Another thing with the cycles are, you can be in stage two in your business, and you can be in stage four with your primary relationship, or you can be in different stages with different relationships, and in different parts of your life, which is really kind of interesting.

Then the kind of coaching that you need, the kind of moves that you want to make, the kind of activities that you want to be focused on doing are different for each phase. I think they work for this overarching thing, but they almost are like in any one day, sometimes you have those days where you still feel like you’re going through all four of those stages in the course of 24 hours.

Candace: Sometimes within one hour.

Dani: Right. Then what Martha did, ’cause I did my life coach train with Martha Beck, what Martha did was really look at the transformation stages in terms of the butterfly, the life cycle, and the caterpillar turning into the butterfly.

The first thing is, the caterpillar starting to melt down. What we learned in life coach training is that when a caterpillar is in there, it completely melts down. It doesn’t somehow morph from caterpillar to butterfly. It melts down into total goo. The first stage is the meltdown-

Candace: I really didn’t know that, and I’m finding it a little disturbing.

Dani: Yeah. I’m with you on that … I really am … but the analogy, the symbolism of it is beautiful, though, because how often do we feel like we have melted down to nothing, we’re broken, we’re at that level that it’s just like, “I don’t know who I am. I don’t know what I want to be,” nothing. It’s all questions, and it’s no form. There’s no answer or whatever. I think it’s a really beautiful place to be, really, if you can kind of get past that.

Then there’s the reformation, which is the work that the caterpillar does, the goo does, in the chrysalis to reform into a butterfly. Then there’s the emergence from the chrysalis, and then there’s full flight. That’s another way of looking at the analogy.

I love the analogies for all this, ’cause it just helps learning, and it helps me to learn whenever I look at analogies too. Anyway, I just thought if we kind of start there with some sort of frame of reference for talking, and then just talk about what’s going on, and what stages, and what’s challenging with different stages, and kind of where we are now maybe.

Candace: Yeah, for sure. I love the symbolism of it. I really do. It’s like the breaking down before the building up. I love that, just the very physical caterpillar vision, in my mind, is not quite so beautiful.

Dani: Yeah, I’m with you.

Candace: I love that. In the way that you described all of that, it really reminded me of the death card in tarot. I know, Natalie, you got that last week or something, and you were concerned that it was negative, but it really represents something so beautiful, and it really represents, from my perspective, almost this whole transformation process in one card. It’s the death and rebirth. It represents everything in between.

Dani: That’s a big step, it really is. In this big transformation, for me right now, I feel like I’m in a big transformation. For those who don’t know, I just had a birthday. Birthdays are a time for me of a lot of that reflecting, and intention setting, and kind of coming together, letting go, and looking ahead, looking back, and looking forward.

That is the card. As I move forward now, having let go of a lot, and having a more clear vision, and being really in action, which I’ve really enjoyed this last week, of just really being in a lot of action around things, it’s felt really good.

What was I gonna say? With that … I forgot what I was gonna say. Sorry, guys. (We can cut this or leave it in, I don’t care. Just past 8:30)

Oh, the death and rebirth, I’m noticing that it happens in moments, where I have a thought, and I recognize it as, “Oh, that’s the past story, that’s the old me, that’s the old thought, that’s the habit,” and letting it die, and not giving it that attention, and turning my attention, through the power of my intention and the power of my focus to the new thought, which is, “Oh, look at that. The old is dying,” and that’s all it takes, ’cause then the new thought is, “Well, what’s now possible?” It takes over automatically.

I’m almost saying death and rebirth, I can see in moments, and with the application of every single thought that I have, and is it something I want to fan the flames of, or is it something I want to let go of, and let die, and give birth to something new. I love that.

Candace: That’s beautiful.

Natalie: Yeah, and I think so often that you see death as a negative thing, so it can be when something’s going, you can not want to move forward onto the next thing. You can keep holding onto the thing. You need to remember that it is a cycle, and so everything is gonna have its beginning and end. It might not necessarily end in the typical death sense, but it’s gonna morph into something new, as a new cycle commences.

I think that’s sometimes where the phases get difficult, why people get stuck in that one place, where they’re in the death, but they’re clinging onto that thing for dear life, rather than looking at the beauty and the next step … I forgot what it was called, but the emergence of the rebirth, or the new birth.

I think it’s really interesting. It’s in so many areas, so cycles are like … there’s obviously the seasons, the spring, summer, autumn, winter, which is exactly the same. I was part of Kate Northrup’s Origin program, and she talks a lot about the different stages.

Similar to what you’re saying in life coaching, but they describe it slightly differently. There’s the emergence stage, which is the planting of the seeds. There’s a visibility, which is then the launching or the creative in getting yourself out there, a bit like a flower. I guess it’s like spring, summer. Then culmination, which is like the wrapping up of that, and the reflection, and then the new, and the consolidate, integrate. What’s going on? What do we want to do next? Then back into the cycle.

It’s really like that for every stage of business. Every business goes through that, whether you’re launching in the typical sense, or it can just literally be you being out there, and looking at what you’re offering, and then changing it out because it doesn’t feel aligned anymore, things like that.

It’s interesting how the same kind of things mix in with moon. You have the full moon and the new moon. You have the intention setting new moon, and the releasing, letting go full moon. That all still fits in with the same sort of cycle that you kind of follow. That’s in everything.

Dani: I love it. I love how nature is always right on. You mentioned the seasons, and the moon. Nature is our guide. I have never been a really big nature person, even, but lately I’ve gotten so into the moon for that, for the transformative power and the extra energy of those moons and things, and really noticing that. I think that’s beautiful, and I love the idea of ritual, and ceremony, and just doing different things around the full moon and the new moon, to help those cycles along, and because every month is a great time.

Natalie: Yeah, everything as well with the moons. Female cycles are often based around the moon, which is really interesting as well. Really, I think that historically, so you ovulate on the full moon, when it’s light, and then bleed when it’s dark, I guess is the way they described it. That’s the same kind of cycle.

Female bodies are inherently built to go through that process. They have the creative stage, and they have the wanting to retreat phase, and integrate. I think that’s a really interesting thing, because women, we just live life and do business exactly the same, forgetting that even we’re built hormonally … is that a word? … to go through these cycles, and to do the different things month on month, but we tend to forget it.

Actually, a lot of people are on contraception that suppresses those hormones, so it suppresses our natural journey through that cycle, which is interesting as well, ’cause we just want to feel the same every day, and not experience that cycle. We just want to be this consistent thing.

It’s again, resisting the cycle of it, not wanting that to be the case, rather than seeing it as the beautiful thing that it is.

Candace: We had conversations about that previously, and how that’s even reflected in family structure, and marriage, and is there a cycle and a season for relationships, versus a lifetime marriage. In what you’re saying, it’s similar in a way that we are raised to believe that things are supposed to be a certain way, and we’re supposed to feel good every day as a wife, and a mother, and a friend, and a sister, and a daughter.

You’re just supposed to be steady. You’re supposed to be a workhorse. You’re supposed to keep it together. There isn’t a lot of space that we give ourselves to have that full cycle. It’s, “No, I just need to push through. I just need to push through. I just need to push through.” I think, not only in our daily lives, but just in our emotional and spiritual lives.

I think, as a rule, most women don’t give themselves the opportunity and the space to really go through each stage, to go through each cycle.

Dani: Absolutely. I think we honor other things above our own needs, and above our own intuition, above our own cycle, above our own nature. I think that you’re right, Candace. I think that there’s a point there too, that you’re already pointing at, which is, it can be even worse on the spiritual journey because it becomes like if you’re not high vibe all the time, then you’re doing something wrong. It’s that there’s something wrong with you.

Once you know you’re the creator of your own world and life, then if you’re not high vibe all the time, then there’s something wrong with you. I think that is a consistent message in a lot of transformational programs and things, that is live on the beach and have this picture perfect, kind of fake perfection of a life all the time, and it’s easy, and it’s this, and it’s that. It just discounts everything that goes into it, and the natural rhythm, and the coming, and the going, and the time and space for everything.

Candace: I think that the words that you just used were perfect, like a natural rhythm. We are so out of sync with our natural rhythm, and the natural rhythm of the earth, and Mother Nature, and the trees, and the plants, and the seasons. We’re just so out of touch with the natural rhythm, that we’re so out of touch that we don’t even know we’re out of touch. Do you know what I mean?

It’s just gone so far the other way, which then brings you, really, to the question, “How do I have that in my life? How do I find that natural rhythm in my life? How do I incorporate that into my life? How do I know …” especially with spiritual development, and spiritual growth, and stuff.

It’s like this constant journey, and this constant yearning, and this constant seeking of more information, more enlightenment, being more in touch, being more transformed. It’s just constant. It’s constantly seeking for that next piece of the puzzle.

For me, the question is, when is it the time to slow down? When is it the time to integrate? How do I know? How do I tune into that within myself to know that this is just a slow time, and I just need to take a deep breath, and really incorporate this into my life, similar to what you’ve been doing in the last week, Dani.

In hearing you talk, and I’m not going to speak for you, but it seems like that’s really what’s been going on for you. You were seeking for a long time, and this last week, it seems that you’ve really not only started to take action, but really started to incorporate everything that you’re learning, and stopped seeking for a moment.

Dani: Well, there’s so much in what you just said. There’s so much in what you just said. I think the constant seeking is a big thing, but I don’t want to glaze over it, because I think before that, you asked a powerful question too. Let’s save the seeking

Because I want to be there. You asked a really powerful question before that, which is, how do we get back in that natural rhythm? It brings up two things. Maybe you guys can give your thoughts on each of the two. I know I’ve incorporated both of these without really realizing I was doing it, but now that you bring the question, it brings the understanding.

The two ways are what Natalie said and we have already put together right here, which is number one, going back to nature, and paying attention to the moon, and what it’s doing. Then number two, going into our own bodies, and listening to our own bodies, and intuition, and feeling in our own bodies, being connected again to our own bodies, and following that, and having that sense where, “I’m tired today. I’m gonna honor that,” things like that.

The two ways, I think, the two pathways to get back into that natural rhythm are from nature and from our own bodies.

Candace: Then I have more questions about that. What does that mean? What does that look like, to connect back to the moon cycles? I know something that you mentioned, Dani, is setting intentions and releasing on new moons and full moons, but to really kind of get in rhythm with the cycles of the moon, is there more to it than that? Is it more than those two?

It’s probably more than two days out of the month that you actually focus on that, but what happens in the middle? What happens in between?

Dani: Well, I think that it’s just a combination of going back and forth between nature and between your own body. It can be spending more time in nature, which is what I did over the couple of days for the retreat, in the log cabin out in the woods, and just reconnecting, and like we were saying earlier, recognizing that nature has four seasons, and that your favorite flower does not bloom all year long.

I just think that it’s kind of starting with an awareness, and I think that it is different for all people, but I know for me, I have a call to be in nature so much. Being a person who lives in the suburbs and has four lanes of traffic out in front of my house every day, but I also have a huge oak tree in my front yard.

It’s can just be connecting in that awareness of how nature works, and to appreciate the beauty, and to draw parallels to my own life some more. I don’t know. Natalie, have any thoughts on that?

Natalie: I don’t have the answer, but it’s like you’re saying, we know that the new moon should be intention setting, full moon should be releasing, but then at the same time, we’re also saying pay attention to our own cycles, and you might not be in that sync. The time where your body is wanting to release, the moon might be intention setting, so then which one do you follow?

I think that’s really tough, but I think generally, your body is probably the safest one to go with, given that’s you, that’s your cycle, and often, you find it actually changes. It can totally switch in sync, and your cycle could change as a result of an awareness or a change in what you’re doing.

I think your body is the main thing, but how would you know? This is a thing where the mind gets in the way all the time, as it always does. What I wanted to say was, I think the awareness of this is one of the first steps of being aware that everything has a cycle. When you’re starting to feel like it’s more pushy to be creative, you can then think, “Well, what does that mean? Where am I now? Is this more like harvesting and integrating? What stage am I in?”

It’s too easy, like you said, to seek and to keep wanting the next thing. When you’re in creativity, and you’ve made so much progress, and it’s that close, and if I just keep going, I can get there, but it’s just not necessarily for you, then that is tricky. I don’t know. I don’t know the answer.

Dani: Yeah, I think that’s beautiful. I think you’re onto something though, that the body is the number one. It’s the number one go-to.

Natalie: It’s balancing the feeling versus the wanting, so how do you tell?

Dani: Yeah, and I think you’re pulling us beautifully into that big, powerful second question that Candace had, which was the seeking, which is something that we started to touch on. We know ourselves as seekers. We know ourselves as these growth oriented, always the next thing, in a constant state of evolution and growth, and it can be exhausting, and it can also be that pull, or even maybe we push sometimes to keep going, keep going, keep going.

Some of the problems with it are just that number one, we don’t recognize, give ourselves credit for how far we’ve come, we don’t always appreciate the present moment and where we are, ’cause we’re always looking at the next thing.

It kind of has this connotation of the present moment and where we are not being good enough, because there’s always more. Because we see that, I think that’s a huge topic that’s fascinating.

Candace: It is fascinating, and it is a huge topic that might be an episode all on its own.

Dani: I think it is, and I think since it still wants to come up really badly, I feel like right now. I feel like to one extent or another, we can really recognize this thing, where it’s like, “You know what? Maybe for a week, or a day, or a month, maybe I can stop all this seeking and just kind of enjoy, just breathe, and what if I didn’t have a list of crap I’m working on?”

If I look at my list of shit I am working on, everything from money mindset, to marketing, to getting out there, to everything, to being a mom, to being all of it, look like a pile, like I have this miracle morning, and setting new routines, and new habits.

It’s overwhelming if I pull it out and kind of look at it. It doesn’t seem that way, in the moment, to me. It seems like fun, and it’s just kind of my natural way of being, but at the same time, I kind of feel this wave of relief if I just think, “What if I didn’t have anything to work on right now? What if I could just let everything be right now?”

Candace: I’m kind of chuckling, because in hearing you talk about it, the ridiculousness of it, it’s so obvious to me. I’m like, “Really? You’re gonna change all of that, all at once?” Honestly, my to do list just mirrors yours. Then I’m like, “What am I doing to myself? No wonder I feel overwhelmed. No wonder I feel like it’s information overload, because I’m fixing the world, all right now.”

I know that we’re all really superwomen in our own way, but talk about setting yourself up for failure.

Dani: I know, and I love that we can see it in the other person, and not always see it in ourselves. I love that so much. It’s so easy for you to see it for me, and then it’s like, “Oh, wait. Is there a mirror around here somewhere, because that sound like me too.”

Candace: Exactly. Just this morning, I was adding to my list. “Okay, I’m cutting out meat. I’m gonna cut out all sugar. I’m gonna do this and start my exercise plan, in addition to the money mindset, and the self work, and the self love, and the whole drama that’s been going on on Facebook that lasted a while, and …” Really?

Then I sit there wondering why I feel overwhelmed, and feel like I just need to take a step back and stop … I don’t want to say stop trying, but it’s almost like stop trying, just be. To just be seems so fricking foreign.

Natalie: I think it’s the age we’re in, where everything’s instant, and you expect everything to be instant, so you expect your own transformation to be instant. You can’t just be, because there’s always messages, Facebook notifications, email, and it’s just, we are inundated with way more information than anyone has ever been before.

We have all these ideas, or suggestions, or people preaching, telling us what we should be doing to make our life better. It’s this pressure, and it’s like this smog that you’re trying to just get through. It’s little bit desperation for me, to get through it, for it to be done, so I can actually breathe. It’s like I want it to be done so that I can breathe again.

Candace: But every time you get that one thing done, there’s something else.

Natalie: Yeah, yeah, yeah. It’s a never ending smog.

Dani: That’s funny. I have a couple things coming up. One of them is that for each of these things that we’re doing though, there is … Let’s say we’re noticing a thought that we’re having, or that is a contradiction to something that we want, so we notice it coming. Can you tell I’m doing a lot of thought work lately?

We notice the thought, and then we question it, or we defy it, or we decide not to put our attention there, whatever tool we apply to it. I’m speaking for myself in transformation. There’s a lot of things you can do when you notice you’re having a thought that doesn’t serve you.

You do one of those things, but here’s the thing. It is work to kind of notice and to fill that conscious choice to notice and to feel that conscious choice to flip it around, but there’s also relief immediately that says, “Oh, I don’t have to believe that thought, or I don’t have to think that thought anymore. I don’t have to take that on anymore.”

There’s a sigh of relief right there. If we’re doing this work so often, there is a reward immediately that actually lightens the load. Then, of course, eventually, our new way of thinking is just forever changed. We get to that tipping point where we’ve questioned enough thoughts and practiced enough, where then, this is just our new way of being. Then it becomes easy, and it becomes our go-to thought more often than not, so that’s a whole new way of being.

That’s the promised land of what we want. It can sound like a lot of work and everything, but if we’re appreciating it in the moment, we can get some relief and see the benefit, and not have it seem so much like work.

Go ahead, if anybody has anything to say about that.

Candace: I’m kind of just processing what you said. Logically, I fully understand what you’re saying, but there’s a part of me that is resisting what you’re saying.

Dani: “That’s not true, Dani. It’s hard! It’s hard work.”

Candace: I don’t know if it’s that. Give me a minute to think on it, and then …

Natalie: If I think I understand what you’re saying, then I think that I agree, because I’ve had that before, in coaching with Dani. I’m a very verbal processor, so I’ll be talking about things, and we’ll go through it, and all of a sudden, she’ll shine a light on something, and I go, “Oh, yes,” then all of a sudden, that’s gone.

I do feel it lifted. I do feel that’s that piece gone. I do agree that can be easy, but then often … Wait, now I’m going back into my thinking processing stage.

Have you got something, Candace?

Candace: Yeah.

Natalie: We’ll just tag team in our thoughts.

Candace: I think the part that I’m resisting to is that in the way that you were talking, it’s like if you do the work and you change the thoughts, then there is the relief. There is, I totally agree. I think the disconnect for me is in the sheer amount of change that I’m trying to institute at one time.

While I agree with what you’re saying, and it’s true, once you get it, or you change the thought, or even sometimes just awareness, like Natalie was saying, about a situation, it can just be like, “Huh, that’s better,” and then it’s gone, unless you bring it back in.

There’s just always so much, and I think that plays back to not living in the moment, and not appreciating for the moment, and to always continually be the seeking. It’s like, how do you find a balance between growth and transformation, and keeping yourself moving forward without it being so overwhelming, without it being so much, without it being a list 15 deep with I’m doing this, and I’m doing this, and I’m doing this, and I’m doing this?

Then when you don’t follow through on all of them, then it feels like failure, so then you push harder. Then I’m even less likely to follow my natural rhythm and take the time off, because I know, at that point, I’ve been pushing myself so hard that if I actually give into that, I’m going to be watching trashy TV on the couch for a month straight.

Dani: Yeah. Well, I think that’s such a good awareness and good self awareness. There’s no substitute for that. Just knowing that you do that, that’s the deal right there, and choosing to take all that on. You have to take into account what you have going on in your life right now, like we all do, but come on, Candace. How many things do you really want to pile on there?

Even with my own journey, I am so anxious to find a solution to this extra weight that I’m carrying around. Spirit keeps telling me, “Quit pushing. These are times of such amazing change, and food is your one comfort. You don’t need to tackle this at the same moment you’re climbing these other three mountains. It is not the right moment. It is not the right season.

If you will wait until this driving need and compulsion to have it just right now, this time where you need it so badly, if you just wait ’til this passes just a little bit, you’ll have the space, and you’ll have the creativity, and you’ll have the inspiration for the way that it can be easy. Right now, it can’t be.”

We go back to, how do you know that? That’s listening to that intuition and being with our body. How does it feel in the body? How does it feel in the body to think about giving up meat? Does it feel hard, or does it feel amazing? If it feels amazing, go with that one.

The next thing on the list, how does it feel? Keep consulting the body. Keep consulting the intuition and things maybe.

Candace: Well … Sorry, go ahead, Natalie.

Natalie: I was just gonna say, I agree, it’s the amount that you push. It’s like, “Does this feel like a massive resistance when I’m trying to do it, or does it feel like I’m pushing against a big force?” I think whenever you’re pushing against a force, it isn’t the right time, because although not everything in life is always going to be easy, paying attention to that, I think, will help you focus on the things that you should be focusing on.

You will drain a ton of energy. If you’re trying to push this massive board up a hill, you’re not gonna have the energy to get to the top. It’s like the universe’s way of telling you, or your body’s way of telling you … however you look at it … that’s not where you should focus your energy right now.

It doesn’t mean that you’re not going to achieve the things you want to achieve, but it just means that actually, it’s not the thing right now. At the right time, quitting meat will feel really, really good. I don’t know if it feels good or bad to you, but at the right time, it will feel really, really good.

Candace: Well, for me, just like Dani is saying, her guidance was, “Now is not the time to cut out food as your comfort,” spirit’s saying to me, “Forget everything else, and focus on your health.” That’s my message all the time. I’m resisting it, because no, it doesn’t really feel good to give up meat.

It’s not that I love eating meat, and I’m gonna miss it. It’s not even that. It’s just learning a whole new way of cooking, and cooking for a family that’s still gonna be eating meat, and the enormous workload that comes with that, of making two meals, and just the whole thing … and I don’t like to exercise, so there’s that.

That’s really the guidance that I’ve been given for months now, a lot of months, that the rest of it will fall into place once I put my health first, once I clear my body. I’m just resisting it, and I’m focusing my energy everywhere else.

Natalie: I think there could be truth in that. There could be truth in the fact that things would get better once you sorted your health. However, that truth can remain, but the fact that you’re resisting it could mean that you’re not ready. It doesn’t mean-

Candace: Well, I think it comes back to the first stage. Right in the beginning, you were like … that people have that death card, just sitting there, waiting for them to grab onto it. Here’s the end of a cycle, and here’s this beautiful new cycle over here for you, and yet they still grip onto the old.

Natalie: Yeah, that’s true.

Candace: I’m thinking that’s what I’m doing, but I can’t help myself.

Dani: I think there will be people who disagree with this, but I really do believe … I don’t believe that everything is gonna be easy, but I believe that when it is time to work on a particular area, we’re gonna be feeling very inspired about it. We’re going to be pulling in these resources and these people to support and to help. The path is gonna be so clear for us, and it’s going to seem easy.

It doesn’t mean that the path will seem easy. The path will seem clear and it’ll seem like it’s calling to us, and that we’re not having to push. I think this is a really important distinction, and I truly do believe it. Then if you feel like you’re beating your head against a wall, stop it. Stop it. This is not the time for this particular thing if it feels so much like beating your head against the wall.

I don’t know, but maybe I just don’t want to face that, that in my world of perfect flow, following spirit, and all of these things, if this is something that I am on the path of now working out for myself, it’s a fascinating freaking question. Is there a time for forcing it?

With everything in my being, I’m saying no. I don’t think that there is. That’s just something for consideration.

Candace: Well, in my case specifically, when I say that I’ve been encouraged to get rid of meat and put my health first for a long time, I’m not exaggerating. It’s literally been probably over a year. It started, I would say, probably three years ago, when I started getting the nudgings towards it.

Now it’s at the point where chicken will make me nauseous. I will still eat it, because when you go out to dinner, there’s a lot of restaurants that don’t have very good vegetarian options or whatever, so I’m like, “Well, I’ll just get the chicken whatever.” Then I eat it, and it literally makes me nauseous to eat chicken.

Spirit, from my perspective, is trying really hard to push me over the ledge, and still, “No, I’m not jumping.” Just in response to what you were saying about it being easy, I feel like spirit is trying to make it easy. I have come across resources. I have been made to feel sick when I’m eating chicken, or pork, or any of these things, and I’m so resistant.

Dani: Why do you think that is? What would it mean if you took care of your health?

Candace: I’m not sure what the answer is, but that question just stabbed me in the heart.

Dani: Maybe it would mean stepping fully into who you are. What excuse would you have?

Candace: God damn it. Okay.

Dani: Sending huge hugs right now.

Candace: There you have it.

Dani: Yeah.

Candace: You’d think you were a psychic or something.

Natalie: That is it, though. It’s just the clinging on, that you’re just not ready to let go. You’re not ready to step into the new cycle. When you are, you’ll just jump all in and go, but you’re just not quite ready. I don’t know what’s the thing to help people be able to let go of that.

Maybe part of it is telling you, you need to give yourself the time that you need. Just because there’s a cycle doesn’t mean that the death part can’t go on until you are ready for the rebirth. The cycle can be as long, in each phase, as is necessary for the individual person, but it doesn’t change the fact that there’s gonna be a next step.

Candace: Well, I don’t know. We’ll wait and see if my resistance fades away. Dani just stabbed me in the heart with that. Just having the awareness might be enough. Then the answer for everybody else is, just book a session with Dani, and she’ll figure out what you’re holding onto.

Dani: I don’t like this. I just stabbed you in the heart. That makes my soul feel so bad.

Candace: No, not in a bad way. You shouldn’t feel bad. It was just-

Dani: Truth?

Candace: ... the red hot truth of it just struck me to my core. I could still cry. It was good. Don’t feel bad. It was good, in one of those transformative moments that are very hard, because to feel the feelings, and to feel the fear, and to feel all of those things that nobody likes to feel is hard. Once I process those feelings and release it, there’s so much lightness and so much relief on the other side of it.

Dani: There is so much. I can totally feel that. I can also feel the other part that you’re coming in now. I think part of everything is just giving ourselves so much grace, and not beating ourselves up for being human and resisting a message from spirit that we’re not ready to fully embrace yet.

We stop pushing against it, stop making ourselves wrong, stop criticizing ourselves for not … in your case, for not giving up meat, and in my case, for not giving up … I’m so far, I’ve got to stop by giving up my fricking McDonald’s.

There’s levels, but it’s not beating ourselves up for those things. It’s practicing really so much acceptance and giving ourselves grace, that I feel like is the real thing that really dissolves some of this stuff so much. It’s the fighting against that makes it so much worse. It’s the making ourselves wrong, and not giving ourselves grace that just exacerbates the challenge and the problem, so just loving yourself right where you are.

To shift gears a little bit, you guys, I made a little note earlier, when we were talking about just the overwhelm of information coming in, especially being in the transformational space. Each one of us being those seekers, and being in this continual growth thing, we get bombarded.

Whether it’s the ads, or the everything, people in our lives who do it, we’re getting these messages all the time about the next big thing and all that. There’s definitely a space for coaching. There’s a space for information. There’s a time for pulling in resources and seeking to understand things that we don’t.

There’s also a time to shut all of that out, and just go within, and know that we have the answers that we need. Sometimes, even those answers will point us to go grab a resource or something. Primarily, what I think would benefit a lot of people, a lot of times in that overwhelmed sense, is just to kind of shut down those external inputs for a little while.

Whether it’s to go to the woods, or whether it’s to turn off our phone for certain hours of the day, our phone, and our computer, and everything, or it’s just to agree maybe not to buy a course for a week, or a month, or something … the one more thing that’s gonna save us, the one more thing that’s the holy grail, that we really need to know, that will make our problems disappear, or make something easier, or whatever.

I’ve been getting a lot of that lately. I love resources, and I love learning, and I do Google searches all the time, and pull in things, but I think there’s also that time. Just like there’s time for standing still, there’s that time to just go within and block all the other excessive noise, because you realize you know better than anyone else, really.

You in your alignment, you in your connection with spirit, literally have all the answers.

Natalie: Totally agree. I love that. Before you even finished, I was like, “Yes, go within,” and then you said the words, “go within.” I love that. Shut out, shut the doors, shut the windows, and just give yourself some time. It’s a bit like the phase we’re talking about, the retreat. You have to build space in your life for that.

Candace: I think that’s the place that I’m at right now, is I just need to shut out everything, because it’s information overload for sure.

Dani: Yeah, I think it can be a huge relief to just think, “I don’t have to listen to anybody but myself for a little while.” Go in with meditation, just go in with introspection, go in with whatever. Even just living and going through life, and going through everything, just only consulting yourself, and not always consulting the group, or the expert, or the more information, or the whatever.

Candace: I like that.

Dani: Are we reaching a natural conclusion here? Does anybody have anything else that they want to bring up or comment on?

Candace: No, not for me. I’m still just reeling over here.

Dani: A little time to process and integrate.

Candace: Yeah, exactly. Natalie?

Natalie: No, I’m good.

Dani: Okay, beautiful. Then we’ll just sign out for today then.

Natalie: Okay.

Candace: All right. Well, thank you, girls. Thank you for that eye opening conversation.

Dani: Thank you. I love you both.

Candace: Love you.


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