In today’s episode we talk about “when x, then x” and explore the ways in which we are constantly striving for the next thing, or making our happiness dependent on something in the future that may never arrive.

Natalie: Good morning girls!

Candace: Good morning.

Dani: Good morning.

Natalie: I had to think then…. what am I saying? Good morning? Good afternoon?What time does this go out? It’s my night, it’s your morning. I don’t know. Anyway, welcome back. Today on the podcast, we are talking about when x…., then x…. So what I mean by that is how recently I had this situation come up in my life where I realized that I’d had this story in my head that when something happened then magic would unfold. Then I would be happy. Then I’d feel complete all those things that we have. So it’s a really interesting topic to dive in because since having this like eye opening thing, which I’ll talk about in a bit, I’ve kind of seen different areas of my life where I do it and not all of them are in the same kind of way. So before we kick off, I wanted to share the card that came up for this topic, which is savoring the positive.

Natalie: Now, I think that we had this card before. However, it’s actually a really nice meaning which I will share with you and it says I slow down and save the positive experiences in my life. I purposely dwell on cherished events and people around me. Savoring the positive allows me to enjoy the moment and accept the delicious gifts that are in my life right now, prolonging my attention on feelings and sensations connected to heartfelt memories, acts of kindness and loving encounters, no matter how big or small, strengthens my capacity to embed them within my psyche. Over time, the practice of savoring the positive builds my emotional resilience, providing a foundation of strength that will support me during stressful times.

Dani: Mmmm Mmmm.

Natalie: So I loved it because it’s like I feel that it really touches on kind of the whole issue with when x, then x, because we’re not in the place of where we are right now. We’re constantly striving to the next thing. We’re not looking at the reality that we have with thinking that all will be solved when this happens, but the truth is, what if that never happens? So we kind of have to be okay with the now. And be looking at the completeness of now or else will we ever be happy because nothing is guaranteed. There’s no guarantee that the when will ever come. So I’ll start by sharing my story and then we can dive into everyone else’s. Like if you’ve done this in your life before or areas that come up for you as we talk about this. So basically the situation that came up for me was I just had my biggest month in business. I hit my first ever $10k month and I thought that like when you hit $10k it meant you’d have everything figured out and you’d feel really happy and successful and fulfilled and all the things. In fact it was my worst ever month in business. I have never felt more close to jacking it all in than in this $10k month… and the other side of the whole wonderful marvelous $10k month is actually the reality is like it was one of my, like my business brought in $10k. But in terms of what it and me and my reality was, it was one of my lowest ever income months. So it just shows you like all these people that are like, “oh I hit $10k this month and I do all these six figure business. It like, it doesn’t mean it saw like fairytales and rainbows is like actually can suck… and I say that,

Natalie: But I say that with, you know, like I know that some people be like, oh, you know, I want to keep anything for that and I feel like I sat here and let my privileged seat going, Oh, I hit 10k months and my life is shit. Like I know that that’s bollox. But um, basically it’s just, you know, the situation was like when I hit $10k than electric in my life out, then I’ll be like, in my biz I’ll be like in my stride, blah blah blah. And instead I’m like, burn this shit down.

Candace: If this is $10k then I don’t want it.

Natalie: Yeah! So I realized that I’d had that story. Like when I do this then I’ll be this and not actually like, I mean we’ve joked like privately about this. Like I feel like it was an absolute accidental $10k. like anyone who knows me knows I’m so anti the whole getting to the $10k.

Natalie: Not as in making the money, but all this entrepreneurial thing where it’s like, yeah, you have to do that. And I’m like, so against the um, I had never had a goal of doing that, but it just accidentally happened and you can tell it’s accidental by the mess I’ve put myself in. Um, but yeah, I think it’s like the situation is, it’s like so when I do this then I’ll be this, well, what if I’d never hit that $10k, what if I always stayed at $5k? What if I always stayed at $7k? Get whatever it is like, well, if I always say two k like it’s about like, that $10k might never come, you know, you can set the next goal, $20k, whatever it is, it might never come. And if it doesn’t like are you ever going to be happy at the current place while ever that story and you’ll head exists that you need this thing in order to be happy because it’s like it goes back to our theme is taking us away from the present moment. So anyway, that’s my little story about it and I think really it’s taught me how, like there’s this constant thing, particularly in the entrepreneurial journey, where it’s all about striving, like it’s striving for the next thing. Once you achieve one thing, it’s like, well what’s next? Or what’s next well what’s next. And it’s so easy to fall into that, it’s so easy.

Natalie: And I think that’s what happened to me. Like I fell into this thing which wasn’t what I wanted, which resulted in my most unhappy month in business ever. And I think that, um, when. So while I thought it was when I hit $10k, then I’ve made it. The reality was when I hit $10K, then I burn out when I hit $10k then I’m unhappy. Like, yeah, actually resulted in the opposite story playing out than the one I thought might be the case in my head. So yeah. Would you guys like to share anything from experiences you’ve had where you have had that kind of game playing in your head? Those kind of stories?

Candace: Definitely, definitely those stories play out all the time. If I do this, then I will be happy. If I lose weight, then I’ll be happy. That’s a story that I’ve had for many, many years. When I lose weight, then I will feel confident. Then I will feel sexy. Then I will feel good, then I will have energy. Then my world is going to be amazing and I don’t have a story that disproves that yet, but that is a huge theme for me.

Dani: It’s funny because I was, when I was thinking about this episode, I just wrote down some of mine off the top of my head that I didn’t even. Some of them you realize you have. Some of them you didn’t. And it’s funny how similar they are, Candace, a lot. Like I wrote down a few of them and every time I read back over them I just giggle. So when I lose weight, I’ll feel sexy and confident. When I feel sexy and confident, I’ll attract my soulmate. When I find my soulmate, I’ll be happy. When I’m more evolved, then I won’t suffer so much. When my kids are grown, I’ll have freedom.

Natalie: That’s a big one.

Dani: Um, when I have x amount of money in the bank, I’ll feel secure and it’s so funny, you know, that we all have these and they are so, some of them are kind of universal, kind of, um, yeah. But, um, I, I like how you put it Natalie and I just want to throw in because you already brought in this idea of privilege. So we sit in privilege about most of the, about a lot of this, right? Because there are people without a place to live without something to eat. So we say that. So we want to acknowledge that and, but this actually kind of plays into my, one of the stories that I had, right? Because, um, for a long time I have struggled with that financial thing of like, oh, and I have just have a little bit of money. Then I’ll be happy because there’s so many stressors when you don’t have the money. We’re not money for rent or not money. You the worry, is that right? Whether it’s true or not, it never really happened, but it was always the kind of, there playing in the background. But you have this thing where we do know that like in reality, once you get to a certain income level, as, as as a regular family, $70, $80,000 in United States that you have kind of enough to cover your basic necessities. You have a house, you have some insurance, you have, you’re saving a little for retirement, you might have some debt, but you’re, you’re reasonably stable and everything. And that is where they, the saying money can’t buy happiness is true up to about just this median household income. And then after that it’s true. Lots and lots more money buys almost no more happiness if any at all, but up until you’re at survival mode with paying rent and food and all of that stuff. It is a real thing. So we want to acknowledge that first. Right? And so I was like right there. I was like right there in this thing. But here’s the thing, my story in my head became, I used Maslow for proof of his hierarchy of needs, right? Saying if I’m not sure about my shelter and my basic, then I can’t get to the higher level thoughts. And I had this whole story about how it was true in my life and how Maslow proved it with his theory and everything, but what it succeeded in doing was keeping the in survival mode for longer than I needed to be in because I had this story that I believed was true. So there are so many nuances around it and we’re not, we’re not really saying, you know, deny reality or anything like that, but it is your mindset can make such a huge difference because what it is, is what it is. So it’s only how you think about it that’s going to change anything. It’s how you perceive it or how you, right. And, and, and you already hit upon Natalie. The number one problem with this kind of thinking is you may or may not hit that goal. You hit your goal, didn’t even have the goal hit that goal, some imaginary thing. And, that everybody talks about and weren’t happy. Well, you could have never hit it and then felt like a failure, right? Like if you did have it. But that’s the biggest problem with it is all this future. Like I have to have future to have fulfillment when all we really have is right now, right now in this moment is all we have. So if we can’t, so if we’re always looking to that next moment or some moment down the road that’s somehow better than this moment, now we are missing literally our whole lives. And that is the big deal about it, you know?

Natalie: Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And the way you put it as beautiful that you’re literally missing it. You’re missing your whole lives because you’re not present in it. You’re not seeing your life. And it’s funny thing Candace was, was talking about the weight thing and um, you know, she was like, I haven’t had a story that disproves that yet. So when I lose weight then I’ll be happy. I think it was the belief but what I wrote down was “what if that’s what’s keeping the weight on?” So the story is literally keep because you believe you have to lose it to be happy. The message is going until you get it. Like, do you know what I mean? I know that sounds really silly, but like things like that where you have the story it’s this thing where you’re not being okay with the you now and until you become okay and happy and content in the you now maybe it’s not possible to change. I don’t know. I’m interested to see what you think to that.

Dani: It’s that whole, um, I’ll believe it when I see it versus I’ll see when I believe it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Candace: Kind of on his head like, that just sent me reeling a little bit because I’m like, so what if that is the case, do you know what I mean? Like if that is the case, then what I believe about happiness and fulfillment is all wrong.

Dani: Well, it’s not that it’s wrong, it’s just in my current understanding and I have to say that like before everything, because I feel like I’m kind of evolving and changing. So where I am right now on this date, my current understanding is it’s not wrong, it’s just a certain level of consciousness. So on a certain level of consciousness, on the level of consciousness of thought and action, then um, yes, I work towards this and I meet a goal and I feel great and how long does it last, right? But to get to those deeper levels of fulfillment, you have to get to deeper levels of consciousness. So it may be true on a certain level of consciousness and, and it may be true that most people will go through their lives on that very level of consciousness. I go in, I work my job, I save a little for retirement, I look forward to vacation, I keep plodding along and I know my rewards are coming. Oh, it’s Friday night, I get to be happy. Oh, it’s Sunday night. I get to be depressed about Monday. Right. Like all of that is kind of connected. Does that ring true?

Candace: Yeah, I mean I think it makes sense and I think when I was saying that like maybe, I mean part of it is that I’m still processing and internalizing for myself because it obviously is such like a deep rooted issue for me, so it’s like bringing in this new idea, this new way of looking at it and so I’m trying to like process in the moment and then be able to speak about it. But I think, I think it’s more that like when I say if, if this is true then what I believe is wrong, it’s more of like a realization that what’s been said feels true and rings true and maybe like logically it makes sense, but then it’s aligning the thoughts and the feelings and sitting in that place of, Oh wow, what if.

Natalie: I think what a lot of it kind of stems from, you know, in my mind, and we’ve talked a little bit about this before with the whole kind of expectation topic, but it’s really all around these preconceived ideas of what life should look like. So, I mean, it’s a tricky one. So I’m going to, I’m like just trying to use the examples that you guys have come up with. So Dani, for example, you talked about your soulmate. So we all have this preconceived idea that we should be in a partnership that, that will last a lifetime because those are the kinds of things that are sold to us as we grow up and what is defined by society where we live as the norm. Um, so, you know, where does that, I can remember what your belief was around that. So when I lose the weight, then I’ll find a soulmate, then I’ll be happy. It was like, so what? I find the soul mate and I’ll be happy. So, so it’s, it’s, it’s that belief that you need that person to be happy and what if you didn’t? And I know that’s a really easy thing to say because you know, you can go through life and then, you know, if you don’t have that partnership because it can be lonely or you know, there’s all those different elements to why you might want to have that partnership in your life.

Natalie: But I just think a lot of these, um, stories that when x actually don’t always come from us either, they’re not always necessarily ours. They’re things that we’ve just thought to be the only way. Not realizing that there is another way that’s like you’re saying Candace, with the belief of the weight, like you believe it to be a certain way because society tells us that we should feel good, look good way. Wear the clothes that are in the stores, that you know, all that. Then all the things. And maybe there’s another way.

Dani: I completely agree. And I would even go so far as to say, Natalie, that almost every belief we have, if this then that almost everything is driven by society, by our parents, by our conditioned beliefs. All of it is. And so until we strip so much of that away, we don’t even know what we want, what makes us happy, what, because we are just going through the motions and we’re on autopilot most of the time and, and a lot of people go through their whole lives and never even question it or you know, either don’t want to or don’t ever have that inclination like they could or want to or um, or need to, which is fine, you know, it takes all kinds. We’re all on all, on different journeys. But yeah, I would argue that’s a huge part of all of it.

Natalie: The other thing that came up for me when I was thinking about this topic was how does that aspect of it and the stories that you have about when you do this, then you’ll be this. But it’s also how you can use this as your way of getting round things. So I’ve had this task on my to do list for the past two weeks that I’m supposed to have done and every day I’m like, I want to have done this, I’ll do that. And there’s always another this! There’s always another this that keeps coming up to stop in my that. So I’ve also found this to be a really powerful way to procrastinate.

Candace: Yeah. I might be guilty of that.

Dani: Yeah, just as you’re saying that, I think that comes up for me a lot. Or it’s like, well if I do this then I have to do that. So I’m going to close the whole door right now. Right. So I can’t clean out part of my closet because really the whole thing needs cleaned out and I don’t have four hours to do the whole thing, so I’ll just not do it right now until I really have the time to dig in and do it right. Yeah. It’s so funny, but it’s, it’s all the mind. All of it is.

Natalie: Yeah, exactly. So I just found that funny phrase. So I think it’s like a really useful so I might even just like right on my walls and open like when is this, when this, then this, then I can kind of this start to become aware of all the ways you’re doing that, all of the stories that you have in your head or you have a belief that you can’t be happy in the now because you don’t have this, this thing is going to give you the magic pill that’s going to solve all your problems. But actually when you get there it’s just another problem. And it’s like, I think it was Gary Vee, I was chatting to someone recently and they were quoting him to say that he’d had this thing that when you have more money, more problems, and again this is like a privilege thing, but when you have one and it can be like just because you think, oh, when I’ve got that then everything will be okay. Like actually it doesn’t necessarily work like that. Like there’s just different problems and you know, I have, I have a client who is really successful and you know, she just lost tens of thousands of dollars because of one mistake in one funnel because that’s all it takes. When you’re playing with bigger money, you’re playing with bigger potential losses so it all, you know, it plays around even if even if you have the, the, then whatever that be, whether that be the money, whether that be the weight loss, there can be all sorts of other things that come in at that moment which prevent you from achieving the thing that you think you’ll receive in that moment.

Dani: And I just went to this is so bringing up the last podcast about peace. So where do you go? If it’s not all? Well, when this happens, then I’ll be happy and so then this is the goal and I’m working so hard on achieving it and blah blah blah. Because of all the great things it’s going to bring me like happiness and feeling fulfilled and successful. And so then people will say, well then, well then what? You don’t set goals then you just don’t have any aspirations. You just sit around like a lump, like that’s kind of where we go because I think collectively we also have this story that if you aren’t striving then you’re worthless, that you aren’t, you know, in that mode, then you have no value. But again, I’ll go back to just kind of consciousness and kind of you always have goals. You’re always going somewhere, you always have those things, but it’s the difference is whether this is the whole world that you live in or it’s just the fun part. The stuff I get to do part because there’s deeper meaning, deeper peace, deeper understanding that that is there just in your being not in your doing. Does that make sense? So you have that deeper being, knowing who you are, the truth of who you are deeper then you can play. You can still play with all of that stuff, but it’s not the end of the world if we achieve it, don’t achieve it. All of that kind of stuff. It’s just, it’s putting it in its right perspective. So yeah, I was still have goals and we still play around and have fun with, Oh, when this happens, I’m going to feel like this and so I’m going to walk around for a few minutes right now and just picture my rv out front and plan my trip on where I’m going to go and play with it, but it doesn’t become life or death and it doesn’t become I’m a failure if I can’t do this or don’t do this or we make it mean all these other things. But I think where you have to start to separate yourself from the story a little bit is start with peace, start with a little bit of silence, start with a little bit of detachment and I think the last podcast is really good to go. If people haven’t listened to that yet.

Candace: I think sometimes like in thinking about this type of stuff, a place that I tend to go because I have been to that place where, well if, if I’m not, what do I do? Do I just not set goals from not setting goals than what am I striving for? And to kind of put it in perspective for myself sometimes I think about like how people lived 2000 years ago and they weren’t striving for anything. They were finding food, they were spending time with their families, surviving for sure. So there’s that aspect of just needing to survive in the world, but it was enough just to be, it was enough to just be. And now in the world that we live in, that’s not okay. You need the bigger house, you need a bigger car, you need the all the um, end result things, all of the then X items and at the core the only thing that we need to do is just be, like you said, Dani, like just be. And I think that’s helped me to become a little bit more okay with it. Like, or frame it for me because we are, we are so inundated with you need to strive or you’re worthless, like you said. So I don’t know if that’s helpful, but that was helpful for me to put it in perspective.

Natalie: Yeah. It’s funny because I like, I’ve what have I worked? I don’t know if I’ve even worked on this, but like recently, like I’ve never really set goals ever like, and I don’t say that from a like, oh, you know, like I just be like, its actually like a bit of an issue. Like I have a block to setting goals and I have a block. We’ve talked about this before, like a block to dreaming like a block too. Like what if people asking you the question, what do you want? It generally makes me cry. So it’s not an evolved thing – don’t take any of this like that.

Natalie: Yeah. So I don’t know what I was going with that other than I think that um, so you know, when, when you say Dani, so I know that there’s something that I need to work on and I still have to uncover and dig into what that is. However, you know, when you say so what? We don’t have goals, I’m like yeah, let’s just not. Let’s just stay as we are. And that’s why. And that’s why it was like the joke, the accidental $10 k, and in so many ways, like I didn’t have the goal to get there and I didn’t have a major belief that it would add all my prayers. I just assumed because of everything I’m told by society that in reaching $10k would mean I have my shit together. So it wasn’t the answer to my happiness. And I think that’s maybe where I got there accidentally. I’m like, I don’t want to be here again, Maybe I do, but just in a more balanced way. Um, but yeah, so I think it’s to me, I like, that’s one thing that I really struggle with today is the whole striving thing, the whole what’s next, what’s next, what’s next, what’s next? And I’m like, I’m fed up of the next. Can we just be here. Yeah. Can we just stay right here, ring fence for a little bit and like, I’m drawing this.

Dani: Yeah. Well, the real power of it is what’s really, really wild is that though Natalie, what you do is you, you practice presence and since you are so present and a lot of the things in your life have come together to make you more present and to stretch that muscle, that muscle is so well developed in you of being present, being flexible, not having that plan set in concrete because who knows, it may, it may, it may not, maybe in your control and maybe not in your control. So you’ve had so much of that. You’re so brilliant at it. But ultimately the true irony is we achieve so much more when we are actually in that space of presence. It’s like I’m thinking of Eckhart Tolle. And I was just watching him on Soul Sunday. What is it Oprah’s thing on Sundays she has whatever. Soul whatever Sunday and I’m sitting there talking and it’s the 10 year anniversary of “A New Earth”. His book that came out. And um, and so when he, when it first came out, Oprah had it as her book club and then she did this whole class and she called him to make the initial call to let him know that his book had been selected for her Book Club, which is a very big freaking deal. He was never a household name. I mean he had one book out, but I mean he was, you know, anyway, nowhere near the worldwide sensation. And um, she lets him know, you know, there, there are people talking, they get on the phone and she says, I wanted you to know, I selected your book. And he goes, thank you. And she goes, no, no. I mean, like, for Oprah’s book club, like your book, we’re gonna, we’re going to do your book. I’m just, I’m used to people like, you know, I just want to make sure you understand. And he says, …thank you. I mean like it’s such an achievement. And I’ve even heard Oprah say that she never had goals either before when she, when she started her show, even I think the first time she was, she has said in an interview before, and forgive me if I get the exact thing wrong, but the impression that it made in my mind is until she started her, her school in Africa, that she had never actually set a goal and sought to meet it. And there was a woman who even before then had accomplished amazing things that only a small handful of people ever will. And she didn’t set goals and go for them. So I, I don’t think there’s always that correlation either between setting goals and achievement. I think there’s real beauty in presence and being open to whatever’s there. But whatever path appeals to you, it’s like, it’s kind of like, I don’t want to get too religious or anything. But it’s like one God, many paths. There are so many paths to God. There’s so many paths to success and achievement and they don’t all have to be goals or not goals or you know, whatever somebody’s into.

Natalie: Thank you. I feel better about that.

Dani: So yeah, you’re in good company.

Natalie: Thank you.

Dani: And I think a high kind of a high achiever on all levels, like just as a beautiful person and in business and everything, Natalie, you are. So to get there by not setting goals, I mean it just shows that, you know, we can, there’s so many paths and if you’re just found the right one for you then that’s all that really matters.

Natalie: And I think just going back to kind of other podcasts and show we’ve talked about this, it was just come to my brain, it’s a bit like detachment, let you know it’s about the manifestation and it can have a dream and that’s if you do dream and then release and detachment. So I don’t need to struggle with letting go of the, you know, having detachment because I’m not attached to anything haha! So that makes it easy.

Dani: I think we tend to take our natural see what comes more naturally to us. We tend to take it more for granted, but they really can be our superpowers, you know, I know being reminded of like a certain coach right now and she always used to get in trouble in school for talking too much and for asking too many questions and now she’s an extremely successful coach for talking all the time and asking too many questions, you know, I mean, natural abilities are there for a reason.

Candace: Yeah, absolutely.

Natalie: Well, thank you very much ladies. Is there anything else you’d like to add? No. Well, thank you so much for listening. If you’d like to rate us or leave a review, we’d super appreciate to hear what you think of the podcast and we will see you next time.

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